A night’s sleep following an argument on local radio Wednesday didn’t clear the air between Frederick County Councilman Kai Hagen and County Sheriff Chuck Jenkins.

Rather, the two men held firm their positions on Thursday.

Hagen (D) reaffirmed his belief that he was justified in approaching a traffic stop involving a sheriff’s deputy and a Black driver on June 20, while Jenkins (R) asserted that the councilman was endangering the deputy and the driver by involving himself in the exchange, which took place in the area of Route 15 and Catoctin Furnace Road.

The sheriff brought the matter into public view during an interview on WFMD radio Wednesday evening. Jenkins said he was furious over Hagen's behavior, proclaiming, "Who in the hell does he think he is?"

Hagen did not dispute that he interfered with the stop.

The councilman said Thursday that while he didn’t notice anything “untoward” happening between the deputy and the driver, it “seemed reasonable” to check in on the traffic stop given that the driver was Black and given instances of police violence toward Black people that have made national news since the murder of George Floyd in May 2020.

“I didn’t do it as a County Council member,” Hagen said. “I did it as a concerned citizen.”

At the forefront of Hagen’s mind, he said, was Jenkins’ stance as a denier of systemic racism in his law enforcement unit and in units across the county, which the sheriff brought up on Wednesday’s radio broadcast and which he confirmed to the News-Post Thursday.

Hagen also mentioned a lawsuit from last January, after which Jenkins issued an apology and reached a $125,000 settlement after the sheriff’s office was accused of racial profiling and wrongful detention following a traffic stop involving a Hispanic woman.

Hagen said he doesn’t believe the sheriff’s department is racist, but he wanted to make it known that someone else was there for the stop.

“I support law enforcement,” Hagen, a liberal Democrat, said. “I do not think most cops are racist.”

Jenkins, a conservative Republican, wasn’t convinced.

“By doing what Hagen did, he’s conveying that he believes the sheriff’s department is racist,” the sheriff said.

Feuding isn’t new between Hagen and Jenkins, both outspoken critics of one another.

“I’m not exactly planning on having a thoughtful discussion about it,” Hagen said of his communications with Jenkins involving the incident.

Given their history, Hagen said the sheriff is taking advantage of an opportunity to insult him. Hagen said Jenkins “smells blood in the water.”

Jenkins, meanwhile, said he would’ve reacted the same way if another county leader had been the one involved in the incident.

“I would’ve come after any council member,” he said. “I would’ve come after the county executive.”

In an email to county leadership, Jenkins called for Hagen’s resignation from the council.

Hagen, who announced in March his candidacy for county executive in 2022, said he will not be stepping down from his seat.

“Not the first time I’ve been asked to resign,” Hagen said. “Won’t be the last.”

Hagen has yet to speak with any of his fellow council members about the matter, he said Thursday. The councilman said he is open to discussing the incident with his colleagues if they desire, though he won’t be going out of his way to set up a meeting.

Council President M.C. Keegan-Ayer said Wednesday the council doesn’t have the authority to censure Hagen. Keegan-Ayer expressed exasperation over Hagen's behavior.

“My hands are kind of tied,” she said. “I don’t have authority over the other council members ... I’m not his mother."

She said the councilman’s actions may put a strain on his relationships with other members.

“I’m at a loss to understand what council member Hagen was thinking,” she said.

In the wake of the incident, Jenkins’ email and the radio showdown, Hagen said he hopes the events will foster conversation around race and racism in the county.

Jenkins said that, for him, the incident is done, though he believes it may resurface as the county’s election season nears. The sheriff thinks someone running against Hagen will revisit the discussion.

Follow Jack Hogan on Twitter: @jckhogan

(135) comments

Plumbum

Tells us again where the body cam footage is?

gjthuro

hagen has no business getting involved in a police issue but somehow he seems to believe he can do whatever he chooses...its time for him to grow up

Oh so your inviting Kai to our party 🎉 cool 😎, can you bring a main dish?

What’s your speciality? Anyone have any requests?

schaeferhund

I'm sure Mr. Hagen meant well, and I'm sure there's some reason for him to have his sentiments and suspicions about the FCSO, but there's a paranoia that is gripping these social justice crusaders that makes them believe racism permeates everything down to the subatomic level. We need a sober reckoning on racism in this country, but this drama is not sober. End it.

I think Kai likes to be thought of as social justice warrior, a tad of paranoia is a good thing though, no warrior should ever become complacent in a war! Remember Kai is willing to lay his life on the line for you no matter what no questions asked, he’s prepared for combat ….that’s a good thing right?

gjthuro

What he may or may not have meant is immaterial....police business belongs with the police and why must race be injected into this event

Comment deleted.

Nope not wondering that at all........are you actually making fun of someone's speech impediment? Please tell me that isn't what you are doing ? I don't like what I'm feeling..kinda nauseous

corgikid

Kai is getting a real spanking on national news and it’s awesome. Of course, he might like it.

neilyoungfan25

Which national news channel please?

It's a sin to gloat...just saying

Ain't worried about what the nation thinks....just the people that can actually vote for CE...yeah once again FREE publicity ....things just keep getting better and better for me and my political consultant company..I am still deciding what my fees should be? You have ideas corgikid? ?

gjthuro

He earned it with his ignorant act

Retired and Bored

I believe that The Sheriff (no matter how much I agree with and like him) and this Hagen person need to give u on their "feud". Each has a job to do and do the job you're qualified for Hagen stay in the city/county and The Sheriff take care of Law Enforcement in the county.

Retired and Bored... same here.

Oh sister I so agree with you...it's getting the rest to agree with you that's going to be difficult...they have worked themselves up into such a tizzy I'm afraid they aren't going to be listening to us more logical folk? But remember we are the actual adults in the room..so there's that. Eventually children pay attention to the adults after they have settled down a tad ...just need to be patient with them. Maybe we can throw them a party if they behave? Hear that children??? I'll make a chocolate cake.

teadoffinfrederickcounty

Interesting that a few years back (Oct 13, 2016) it was reported by FNP reporter Danielle E. Gaines about a Cub Scout photo.

# # #

Political Notes: The story behind Billy Shreve and the Cub Scout photo

By Danielle E. Gaines dgaines@newspost.com Oct 13, 2016

A photo snapped by a Cub Scout parent — with a back story that wasn’t as it seemed — caused a stir in Winchester Hall.

The picture shows a den of Webelos posing with County Councilman Billy Shreve in front of the county seal in the council’s chambers.

A couple of the children held up a Trump-Pence campaign sign.

At first blush, the photo may have crossed some political boundaries. A county policy doesn’t allow use of buildings for political purposes, and political activism is against the Scouts’ bylaws.

Criticism online came swiftly.

“Even if Billy didn’t know either of those things ... posing with a pack of cub scouts that came to Winchester Hall, as scouts, as part of their civics education, with a campaign sign for a presidential candidate — campaign in which he has an official role, to boot — shows extremely poor judgement, at best,” Kai Hagen, a former county commissioner, wrote in a blog post shared by the Frederick County Democratic Central Committee on Facebook.

# # #

https://kaihagen.wordpress.com/2016/10/07/county-council-member-billy-shreve-crosses-the-line-again/

In an excerpt from that blog, Kai Hagen wrote:

County Council member Billy Shreve crosses the line…again!

“Even if Billy didn’t know either of those things, however, posing with a pack of cub scouts that came to Winchester Hall, as scouts, as part of their civics education, with a campaign sign for a presidential candidate — campaign in which he has an official role, to boot — shows extremely poor judgement, at best.”

“I will leave it to others to determine what response is most appropriate, and whether or not to file an ethics complaint or take any other action.”

“But no matter what Billy Shreve knew before, based on what he knows now, at the very least — as a starting point — he should fully and clearly and publicly acknowledge his poor judgement and mistake, and he should issue a sincere and specific apology to the Cub Scout pack, the Boy Scouts of America, his fellow council members and the county executive, and the general public.”

# # #

As to Kai Hagen’s most recent display of “contempt for law enforcement,” the facts are not in dispute so I will not rehash the scenario, but this is where Kai Hagen went afoul of the law and reasonable personal conduct.

1 – Stopping/Standing in the travel portion of a roadway creates a safety hazard for Hagen, the stopped motorist and mostly for the police officer.

And was a violation of Maryland Vehicle Law § 21-901 - 1. Reckless and Negligent driving.

Subsection (b) Negligent driving. -- A person is guilty of negligent driving if he drives a motor vehicle in a careless or imprudent manner that endangers any property or the life or person of any individual.

21 901.1 b Negligent driving vehicle in careless and imprudent manner endangering property,

life and person. Fine $140.00 and 1 point.

The police officer has a duty to prevent/eliminate a safety hazard; so, when Hagen refused the order to move his vehicle it violated Maryland Transportation § 21-103.

(a) A person may not willfully disobey any lawful order or direction of any police officer.

21 103 (a) Willfully disobeying (lawful order, direction) of a police officer. Fine $ 290.00 and point 01

Consistent with law, all young drivers are made aware that if a police officer is directing traffic and signals you to stop – YOU STOP! If a police officer signals you to proceed – YOU PROCEED!

It is not within the driver’s discretion to disregard and “do what you feel like.”

The most aggresses violation of law was Kai Hagen’s interference with a law enforcement officer in the performance of duty.

Maryland Code

CRIMINAL LAW

TITLE 9 - CRIMES AGAINST PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION

§ 9-408. Resisting or interfering with arrest.

(a) "Police officer" defined. - In this section, "police officer" means an individual who is authorized to make an arrest under Title 2 of the Criminal Procedure Article.

(b) Prohibited. - A person may not intentionally:

(1) resist a lawful arrest; or

(2) interfere with an individual who the person has reason to know is a police officer who is making or attempting to make a lawful arrest or detention of another person.

(c) Penalty. - A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and is subject to imprisonment not exceeding 3 years or a fine not exceeding $5,000 or both.

I do not know the identity of the police officer involved but suspect Kai Hagen does. Best course of action, contact the Deputy, offer a heartfelt apology for his actions, apologize for disrespect to law enforcement in general and that he is grateful that the Deputy did not arrest him.

Hagen demanded that Billy Shreve apologize for a cub scout photo, this event far exceeds that by a mile.

Had Hagen been charged, he could have thrown himself on the mercy of the court and maybe ended up vacationing on Marcy’s Choice Lane for just 90 days [for a first offense] and received work release to attend council functions.

OMG what a long devastatingly dull post..Tea

Were you trying to make a point? I couldn't find it? Can you maybe give an unbridged version of your point? and Kai can't charge himself...Jenkins needs to do that so..

Plumbum

Hagen can still be charged. In fact, I wish he would be, it’s the rite thing to do

I'm agreeing with you plumbum and I know that Kai will be glad to face the consequences of his actions...remember Kai is willing to throw his life on the line for you no matter what no questions asked if he perceives you are in any threat of danger of harm...he would take bullet for you...a little ole ticket isn't going to trouble him none...he done and given up his life for you...remember that?

Remember the saying about be careful what you wish for because it may come truth...something like that I think..? Maybe that's why Kai hasn't been ticketed and probably won't be...Jenkins is actually thinking things through.. but don't worry Jenkins isn't capable of thinking far enough head to matter none and we will be discussing this for weeks on end...Kai for CE....this is FREE publicity right now...I knew I was paying attention these past four years for a reason...I can thank Trump for that...for seeing this: as what a favor Mr. Jenkins did for his pal Mr. Hagen.

Kai will remember to thank you in his speech when he wins CE...email him with the correct spelling of your name any other words of gratitude you want to hear...

threecents

If what Kai did was dangerous, then he should have been cited. Why is all this hullaballoo necessary? Just write him a ticket, explain to him what he is being cited for, and let him argue with the judge if he disputes the charge. Done. No need to cry about it on the radio or tell his mom to ground him.

EXACTLY...threecents...exactly...

Plumbum

And it’s not too late to charge him, I hope he is charged.

Rockfish

Hagen should have been charged at the time of the incident or before the radio broadcast. Charging him now or a year from now will look purely vindictive.

Well yeah Rockfish, that’s what I’ve been saying! You wanna come to a party? Can you please bring the chips and dip, I like French onion dip the most with Ruffles, I’m bringing dessert, chocolate cake with buttercream frosting. It’s the best chocolate cake you will ever taste, the secret is using hot French vanilla coffee in place of the hot water, well that’s one of my secrets..,,

neilyoungfan25

It’s necessary because Kai is a cop hater and racist running for County Executive. Kai assumed because the cop was white he may not treat the black man he pulled over kindly. Kai admitted if the man pulled over was white he would not have bothered. This incident should have been made public. All law enforcement officers and their families in Frederick County should known Kai does not represent them. And I hope they all vote! The citizens of the county deserve to know about this too. I’m pretty sure the majority would feel Kai went way too far.

Neil you need to read my comments I think you will see that the public isn’t seeing it that way anymore thanks to me? Kai isn’t a cop hater, stop being silly. Kai probably hasn’t gone far enough but give him time he won’t disappoint you in showing how much he cares about cops, 😘😘

islandcuban

Launching your political campaign for county executive this way seems like nothing more than a reckless stunt.

And a deputy's life was endangered to top it off...!

There are other avenues for an elected official to address the concerns voiced in this article.

Silly it was Jenkins that decided in his own polite white person way to help Kai become CE...not the other way around....and Kai didn't endanger the deputy's life anymore than it was already endangered...I mean really now make sure you see the true truth in all of this....just think if Jenkins had kept his mouth shut and stuck with his job and not decided to political grandstand on that radio program none of us would be here discussing it..LOL

I tired of all this fake outrage over the deputy's safety...please.

Though I have found the right doesn't really think things through far enough...and the left refuses to think things through far enough to be of any benefit., but that's what I'm here for... so there is our conundrum.

Plumbum

No broken bones no blood. No one any more endangered than before Sly Kye arrived

Comment deleted.

So pdl about those rocks I mean if they are smarter than me...have you taken them to Vegas yet? You could make some big bucks off those rocks you know? But something tells me I still way smarter than the rocks in your yard....and I haven't gone to Vegas...

Also I found an Eminem video I think you may like...but warning there is explicit language...

Eminem - Venom

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CdcCD5V-d8

Let me know if you need anymore advice that's what I'm here for...peace out

Burgessdr

Hagen is a ever so white privileged busy body. Vigilante. Guilty of racial profiling himself. I doubt that anybody else in the county would have done such a foolish thing. Hagen thinks he is special and laws about interfering with police dont apply to him.

Tsk tsk here Mr. Burgess don't be upset you didn't think of it first...you will have your chance I mean cops pull people over all the time..next time you stop and check on them and maybe you'll get yourself on the frontpage of the FNP? Which FYI Kai had no idea it was going to work out this way...but it did so..

Are you planning on running for office anytime soon? Be advised I probably won't offer my services as a political consultant to you...you aren't very polite at all...

threecents

American History 201: All white people have white privilege in America.

threecents

Maybe Mr. Burgess was absent the day they learned that..???

Rockfish

Bull Crap

Oh were you absent that day too Rockfish? I mean they have makeup classes like everyday, maybe you can get up early tomorrow and go to class to learn about your privileges?

I’m sorry but I can’t do any tutoring just yet and I’m not sure you could afford my rates? I’m probably going to need to be paid upfront, don’t forget the chips and dip for our party 🎉

Plumbum

Disagree burgess. Hagen didn’t even think.

Just like his ballon law. Loopholes. Not worth the paper it’s written on. But he saw they did it in another county and that was good enough for him. No thought behind it.

pdl603

The problem with Kai and democrats is that the

don’t understand that we are all equal under the law. We may not be equal in anything else, but under the law we are. Well, except Hillary and Bill Clinton, Jose Biden, et al.

olefool

AND, Donald Trump and his minions.....

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pdl603

Hey Schizo, I have a yard full of rocks that have IQs greater than yours. To bad.

Dwasserba

‘“I didn’t do it as a County Council member,’ Hagen said. ‘I did it as a concerned citizen.”’ SiGH I’m guessing Hagan felt that ignoring the question raised in his mind when he saw no clear violation, was a problem for his conscience. Circle back, check it out, vs. coming forward later after Frederick makes headlines. Sorry that we are conditioned now to wonder. He didn’t know which deputy or who the driver was, it wasn’t personal. If Joe Bloe had done this, the deputy might’ve resented it but would it be ALL THIS. I say no. Talking about a nobody being nosy to a deputy on the radio would’ve had listeners scratching their heads. Get a grip. Rise above.

Plumbum

Not sure why my brain stimulating comment was deleted, didn’t violate any rules, but here it is again:

Trumpkins was elected to follow the law.

He is too scared to cite Sly Kye as the law calls for.

If Trumpkins can’t follow the law and do his job, and maintain law and order, then what value is he to frederick co

gabrielshorn2013

Yes, the Sheriff was elected to follow the law. What laws has the good Sheriff violated, plumbum? You yourself claimed that the FCSO has a year and a day to file charges. Why the impatience? If you truly believe that there will never be any crime in any jurisdiction where there is a law enforcement agency, you are at best naïve, or delusional.

Awteam2021

Gabe, Jenkins broke the law by arresting and holding an undocumented resident violating the 4th amendment. The county was held responsible. Now the Law Enforcement Officers’ Bill of Rights has been repealed there by making all law officers accountable for unlawful acts and suggest to personal law suits.

gabrielshorn2013

Aw, Sheriff Jenkins, himself did no such thing, as he was not one of the arresting officers, nor was he at the scene at the time of the arrest:

On October 7, 2008, while on patrol, Deputy Sheriff's Jeffrey Openshaw and Kevin Lynch of the Frederick County Sheriff's Office stopped and asked Ms. Orellana Santos for identification. After approximately twenty minutes, Ms. Orellana Santos moved to leave, but Deputy Openshaw indicated that she should stay while he waited to see whether a civil ICE warrant for removal was active. Ultimately, the deputies arrested and detained Ms. Orellana Santos on the basis of that civil warrant. Ms. Orellana Santos was brought to a Maryland detention center, turned over to ICE, and ultimately held in a jail in Cambridge, Massachusetts until her supervised release on November 13, 2008.

https://casetext.com/case/santos-v-frederick-cnty-bd-of-comissioners

The Sheriff is accountable as the head of the department, even if he himself did not commit the offense. The deputies incorrectly used an outstanding active deportation order found in the outstanding warrant database as the basis of the arrest. Such deportation orders should not have been entered into the outstanding warrant database. Officers are justified in arresting someone on an outstanding arrest warrant. It is common practice to check the outstanding warrant database whenever someone is detained.

Awteam2021

On November 10, 2009, Santos filed the instant suit, naming as defendants Deputies Openshaw and Lynch, Frederick County Sheriff Charles Jenkins, the Frederick County Board of Commissioners, and several other individuals from ICE and the Department of Homeland Security. Santos eventually agreed to dismiss her claims against the federal Defendants and to bifurcate all claims of supervisory liability against Sheriff Jenkins and the Board of Commissioners. The supervisory liability claims were stayed pending resolution of the case against the officers. Santos filed a Second Amended Complaint including complaint against: Count V – Supervisory liability, against Sheriff Jenkins, in his official and individual capacities, (bifurcated and stayed) as a separate charge over the same transgression. The “police bill of rights” prevented the personal suits against Jenkins going forward. That wouldn’t apply today.

gabrielshorn2013

Aw, yeah, and...? Santos' suit was against the head of the FCSO, as the head of the organization, not for his involvement. You understand that, right?

MD1756

Classic case of profiling profiling: "The councilman said Thursday that while he didn’t notice anything “untoward” happening between the deputy and the driver, it “seemed reasonable” to check in on the traffic stop given that the driver was Black and given instances of police violence toward Black people that have made national news since the murder of George Floyd in May 2020.""

mgoose806

Hagen slept great last night because knows the FCS protects even jerks like him.

I take it you didn't sleep well last night? I'm sorry to hear that..

Plumbum

How come we never hear / read about Frederick City PD having all these issues?

How come the frederick city PD hasn’t shot any FENCED IN Labrador retrievers?

How come Frederick City PD hasn’t caused death to anyone simply wanting to watch a movie?

How come Frederick City PD hasn’t paid monies out to illegal immigrants?

Why isn’t Frederick City PD providing security to the Great Frederick Fare, a private entity, free of charge at tax payer expense?

Why is the FCSO always embarsssing the county? We did it have this under Hagy or Harbaugh.

Could it be because anyone, regardless of credentials or no credentials, can slap their name on a ballot and run for sheriff? Could it??

Kelly Q Alzan

Also affectionately known as Davey’s

‘Lil Plumbum Pie

FNP commenter of the years 1999 through 2021.

gabrielshorn2013

”How come we never hear / read about Frederick City PD having all these issues?”

Don’t we? We do, but you keep blathering on about the Sheriff when the incidents occur under the jurisdiction of the Frederick Police Department. But you already know that, right?.

”How come the Frederick city PD hasn’t shot any FENCED IN Labrador retrievers?”

The FCSO deputies haven’t shot any fenced-in Labs either. plumbum, and the dashcam video of the incident shows the two dogs coming around the corner of the house toward the deputy. But you already know that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvnbxAygGSg

While you’re at it, watch this report from WBAL about another Frederick County man who died after being mauled by a dog.

https://www.wbaltv.com/article/frederick-man-mauled-by-dog-dies/6860038

”How come Frederick City PD hasn’t caused death to anyone simply wanting to watch a movie?”

If you use the absurd qualifier of “simply wanting to watch a movie”, well, none. But have FPD officers ever had to shoot anyone who later died? Has anyone ever died in their custody, or as a result of their actions? Furthermore, the officers involved in the Saylor case were not on duty, nor acting in any official capacity. They were off-duty, moonlighting as security for the shopping center when the theater management summoned the security staff to eject someone who refused to leave the theater. The fact that their other, full-time job was as FCSO deputies is irrelevant. Are you responsible for whatever your employees do during their off hours? I’m sure they have all been “blessed choir boys”.

”Why isn’t Frederick City PD providing security to the Great Frederick Fare, a private entity, free of charge at tax payer expense?”

How long has that been going on, plumbum? Did the FCSO provide patrols for the Fair during the Hagy or Harbaugh years? Yep, and before that too. But you already know that.

”Why is the FCSO always embarsssing the county? We did it have this under Hagy or Harbaugh.”

You and a small but vocal minority are the only ones that seem to be embarrassed, and it is quite evident that you have a personal vendetta against the FCSO in general, and the Sheriff in particular. It makes one wonder why that is. Why? Was there some involvement with you? Are you trying to save the world?

”Could it be because anyone, regardless of credentials or no credentials, can slap their name on a ballot and run for sheriff? Could it??”

What a silly question! Of course anyone can run. You declared your ersatz candidacy many times. If you are ever elected, will you immediately resign, citing your incompetency?

Plumbum

Copy on file

gabrielshorn2013

Copy of what?

threecents

Can you two please get a room? We don't want to see that.

I agree with threecents..100%..maybe 200%...I would be happy to Venmo you two some money for the room if you would like ? I'm sure threecents would too?

I thank they may charge extra for those people plumbum but sure...it's a good value for my money...

gabrielshorn2013

Sorry plumbum, pass. But hey, y'all get on down to the Motel 6 and get that spankin' you keep asking for. I'm sure you are on a first name basis with the front desk staff, and will get that "frequent flyer discount" you have earned. 😉

Piedmontgardener

Hagen is an idiot. So is Jenkins for crying about it in public. Such is life in a lovely county where many of our elected officials need to go.

Trellis

Fraudulent tags. Period.

Plumbum

The tag wasn’t fraudulent.

The use of the tag was fraudulent.

Blueline

Perhaps Councilman Hagen thought that along with the salary increase, he should take on additional duties by patrolling county roads. My question is, does he put in for a mileage reimbursement?

Plumbum

Like Trumpkins thinking he should take on additional duties of INS agents? You mean like that?

Comment deleted.
gabrielshorn2013

As you claim, plumbum, the FCSO has a year and a day to issue the citation. Patience.

Trellis

What Hagen did was 100% wrong. It's that simple.

Plumbum

Then cite him for it. It’s that simple.

sevenstones1000

Please point out where, in the Constitution, police are permitted to demand that their activities be conducted in secrecy, with no outside observers allowed. Do we really want a Secret Police, with no accountability?

if the cop wasn’t doing anything wrong, he should not object to being watched and even filmed while he is going about his peaceful business.

HappySeller2014

But that is NOT what happened with THIS incident Seven!!!!!!

MD1756

Your Constitutional argument is inane. It's quite simple that blocking traffic is a safety issue. Hagen should have been directed to pull off the road and wait for his ticket for stopping on a highway (not even the shoulder) without having an emergency. In the previous article Hagen basically admitted that he only slightly pulled out of the traffic lane ("Hagen said his vehicle was "ever so slightly" off the road, but mostly on the road, noting he saw no traffic."). Therefore he was obstructing traffic and causing a needless dangerous situation. It doesn't take long at 55 mph (and it seems that traffic flows closer to 65 mph than 55mph) to come from out of view to whizzing by especially at some of the speeds some of the drivers travel at (80+mph).

DickD

Does anyone wonder why Jenkins has so much time to spend on what amounts to little. What does Jenkins do to earn his salary? .

Let's get a police force like Montgomery County and remove all of the political nonsense of Jenkins.

Frankle1

All of this could be avoided if police focused on things that actually mattered and left administrative issues like expired tags to the MVA. Armed officers should not be interacting with people simply because they have an expired tag. Flag their license and let the MVA take care of it. I find it ridiculous we pay cops so much to be armed guards and secretaries for the MVA. Expired registration doesn't warrant a traffic stop. Period.

sevenstones1000

How many of these men become cops solely on the promise that they will get to harass people and feel like Big Men? Look at the history of the sheriff’s dept deputies. How many unwarranted deaths? I can think of several that made national news.

Plumbum

Seven, not just unwarranted deaths, but also unwarranted lawsuits

gabrielshorn2013

If you read the sidebar to the story in the print version of the FNP, you would have seen that the vehicle reportedly had trailer tags instead of the standard vehicle tags. This would have gone unnoticed to the untrained eye. However, it is a "red flag" to a trained officer. It raises the questions in their mind of why is there an inappropriate tag on the vehicle? Could it be stolen? If so, could the driver have been trying to conceal another illegal activity, such as drug running, or fleeing the scene of another crime? Kidnapping? The driver's race is totally irrelevant with such facts, and the stop was justified. Kai Hagen, although meaning well, interfered with an officer in the performance of his duties (as shown by HappySeller below), and should be cited for such.

HappySeller2014

Thank you Gabrielshorn2013. You have made good points as well, and nice example.

In my mind, criminal activity, suspicious activity, or simply unknowingly arousing suspicion in a police officer's eye is colorblind. Anyone is susceptible to doing it, regardless of race, creed, sexual orientation, etc., etc., etc.

It is the reaction to such incidents that is critical. Just like in life, the reaction to an action is often so much more important than the action itself.

I agree Kai should be cited. Then let the courts decide if he is guilty or not.

Awteam2021

If you read the article Kai was asking why the vehicle was stopped and whether the driver felt safe. I don’t see what the big deal Jenkins is making it. I think he should be bragging how professional the sheriff’s department is and once the officer recognized it was a simple mistake gave the driver a couple of warnings, explained the mistakes. - No citations, and sent him on his way. No big deal.

HappySeller2014

Nope. Many of these types of traffic incidents result in arrests or further citations. Scofflaws often have expired tags, stolen tags, etc.

This is a strong way for law enforcement to find people driving with an expired license, outstanding warrant(s), etc. These kind of stops are VERY important. It is anazing how many of these stops, including simple tailights out or driving without windshield wipers on in the rain, lead to drug busts, the finding of missing individuals, etc.

Not ridiculous. Actually VERY smart policing.

No Happy these traffic stops are really a waste of taxpayers dollars...show me the numbers where the benefits outweigh the slight possibility that the cops are going to find someone doing something they shouldn't be?? I mean sure if you stop enough POC you are bound to find something sooner or later ....also you never have to allow the police to search you vehicle...I mean they are going to anyway if they really SEE the need to but, I guess it's like stop and frisk for Vehicle's, but any who, no never give the cops permission to search your car.

So unless the cop that puts his life in danger over writing a ticket for something so trivial also conducts a search on every single vehicle he stops he's wasting his time and endangering himself.. ....and wasting taxpayer dollars and you end up paying for something twice...

It's actually very dumb policing putting the officers life at risk over a traffic stop for expired tags or tags on the wrong vehicle..sorry but I care more about people's lives than putting them in that kind of possible harm.

Let me add...because of the stupid way the police do things....we taxpayers are also paying out a lot in civil settlements.....me I would prefer we stop putting people's lives on the line for stupid stuff we are already paying for someone else to do.

HappySeller2014

Well, we completely disagree Pickles.

Just like we disagree with policing nonbiodegradable laxex condom/balloon massive releases. You support cops running around enforcing Kai's new law, but oppose active police patrolling???

Which side of the fence you really on Pickles? Preventative policing small problems before they grow into larger ones is a core bedrock of effective police work. You do not get to pick and choose what you oversee when you a cop.

So Happy did email Sheriff Jenkins yet? You know to make sure he's going to be giving Kai a ticket....otherwise you agree with me..anything else while I'm here? Peace out..I'll be back around in a couple of hours or so well unless I find something better to do?? then I won't be back. You know you never did actually answer my questions yesterday about your time in the military as I recall? You weren't in combat so what exactly did you do in the military anyway?

Dwasserba

Maybe. But so dangerous. Punting to the MVA could save lives.

kahiltner

Read the copy of Sherriff Jenkins email to the Council. It clearly states the driver had tags that belonged to another vehicle. That is not an administrative issue.

HappySeller2014

It is not an administrative issue here.

I strongly respect those like kahiltner and garbrielshorn2013, who read articles closely and acknowledge the FACTS present in such.

So what,,,send the VH owner a citation in the mail if anything else happens let your car insurance, (who you pay good money to) do the investigation, a cop's ticket isn't going to prevent anything from happening but can for sure cause something to happen on the side of the road that Kai was trying to prevent...how hard is this people?

HappySeller2014

Nope.

Where are you going to draw the line as a cop, Pickles? Expired license plate sticker and registration? Improper tag for vehicle, like in this case? Tinted shading too dark to read plate? Tinted windows to dark? Tailight out? Brake light out? Winshield wipers or lights not on in rain? Talking on cellie? Tailpipe dragging on road? Contents of pickup truck not properly secured?

You DO NOT get to pick as a cop Pickles!!! That is in fairness to all the rest of us. Your argument leaving things to the MVA makes absolutely NO sense.

Why don't you understand this simple policing maxim?[crying][crying]

Happy

YEP...

Dwasserba

[thumbup]Frankie1

classified

Or people could just follow basic laws that would have prevented this whole thing to begin with! Why are people always excusing law breakers? if you want to live in a lawless society go find one somewhere else. I don't have a problem doing that why is it so hard for other adults to do the same.

starxxi

Yes, Mr Hagan. Add more drama, it is convenient for you. It is over: You, obstructed a police officer on his duty comparing that stop with the case of G. Floyd. So be over with it. We, the people (like a person of color like me) don't believe that racism lead that officer to stop that citizen, since he can't read minds, he couldn't see if he was black, purple, white, or brown. Stop the drama! We all know you want to be the next president....but do it right! Don't play dirty and apologize to the officer for you have done. Be the example for the people of Frederick, and colored people like me

HappySeller2014

Superb post.

OMG who calls themselves colored people if they are a POC??? See I have this uncanny ability to see people and then see right through them...no and mean NO POC would ever refer to themselves as colored people....please....

Dwasserba

Yeah I wondered too.

Fiver

I thought the exact same.

HappySeller2014

Colored people exist, as do Blacks, African Americans, and your moniker Pickles, "POCs."

I bet you are either White, Caucasian, Non-colored, and even "NPOC," eh?

Happy...

I'm tired of scrolling down so and yes I'm white I've never hid that from anyone so your point is? I do refer to myself as a polite white woman I find my comments carry more weight and are way more impactful to people if I don't try to be something I'm not...see my words will never give me away you will see the real me the true truth in my words if I am me..a polite white woman.

Whoever decided to call themselves colored people and thought they could pretend to be a POC was seen a mile away as a fake POC..so..I'm not fake I'm real

everything I'm not makes me everything I am...Kayne said it best I think?

Maybe I should be a polite white woman rapper? I see my words are sounding like a rapper....that's kinda cool .....

How's this sound?

Sometimes I can see the truth but I can't always feel the true, because feeling real doesn't prepare you for feeling real, because you are always real you feel others real. You are incapable of feeling fake because there is no fake in what you feel..because you are feeling real never feeling fake.

You can see the truth in people's words because you can see the real in the way they use their words. They can't hide behind their fake real words. Real is real fake is fake and seeing fake is real.

HappySeller2014

Purple, I give you mad props as a verse constructor and verbal wizard. You put that to a rap, or even a country song, you may be onto something! 🙂

Plumbum

If Trumpkins is too scared to cite Sly Kye and follow the law, then you can be assured he’s too scared to “go after the gangs” as he promised over and over he would do.

gabrielshorn2013

Please describe how the Sheriff is not "going after the gangs", plumbum. He works with the Maryland State Police, Frederick City Police, the independent municipal police departments, as well as Federal agencies such as the FBI, DOJ, and ICE on the issue. More innuendo (a.k.a. lies) from you. If you have to lie to make your point, you don't have much of a point, do you?

HappySeller2014

I do believe, with all of his comments and positions taken, that Kai should be very comcerned about this situation. The information below in parens was directly taken from a lawyer website. Parking a car with its tail in the road, questioning a law officer, forcing the officer to respond to you when actively engaged with anothet person, demanding to check to see if driver OK simply because he was black...the list goes on and on. Plus, if others are concerned about how weird the interaction was and an inability to be his mother, I think Kai should be openly investigated now.

"What is Obstructing or Hindering an Officer in Maryland?

In Maryland it is a crime to obstruct or hinder a police officer from conducting an investigation. Obstructing and hindering is a common law crime and a misdemeanor in Maryland. It carries a maximum of three (3) years incarceration and/or a $3,000 fine.

Elements of Obstructing/Hindering

This offense in Maryland is a common law crime, meaning the definition of the offense has been passed down by precedent through the courts instead of being codified by statute. The Maryland courts have defined the crime of obstructing/hindering as consisting of four elements, all of which must be met in order for a crime to be committed. The four elements are:

1. The officer is engaged in the performance of duty. This element is met where the officer is on-duty or otherwise conducting official business and not off-duty.

2. There is an act or omission of an act which obstructs or hinders the officer in the performance of duty.

3. The accused has knowledge that the officer is engaged in the performance of duty. If an officer is undercover and not in uniform, that may be a valid defense as the accused may not know that the officer is on duty.

4. There is intent to obstruct or hinder the officer by the actions of the defendant. This is usually the most difficult element for the State to prove. The prosecution must show that the defendant’s actions amounted to a specific intent to commit the crime–that is, a specific intent to obstruct or hinder the officer from performing his or her duties.

HappySeller2014

What to trust, but verify? Check out...

https://www.perettillc.com/2012/01/what-is-obstructing-or-hindering-an-officer-in-maryland/

What is so concerning here is akin to the squeegie kids issue in NYC. You allow low-level questionable activity to pass by unpunished, it tends to escalate into more serious concerns.

What we do not want here is for members of the public throughout Frederick County thinking they should stop and check in on a cop performing his/her uniformed duties, simply because the driver in not white, but rather Black, Hispanic, Oriental, Native American, Pacific Islander, Eskimo, Indiginous to the Amazon Rainforest Region, or some other commonly understood designation. Imagine the safety and other concerns that would arise if people not directly involved in police activity all of the sudden started inserting themselves into police situations all up and down Route 15, I-70, I-270, Route 26, Route 27, etc.

Riptide262

Happy, very well said. I was trying to find the right way to express my frustration at Hagen's irresponsible actions when I read your letter. Hagen injecting himself into that situation showed remarkably poor judgement. I am not a fan of our current Sheriff's politics but his outrage seems justified in this case. What is a police officer to think when a random person pulls over and approaches during a legitimate traffic stop. What does the driver think when a random person approaches the officer. It seems unlikely that Hagen's actions made anyone feel better other than Hagen. If Hagen is concerned about the Police not acting professionally, then by all means he should follow up. However, that needs to happen without putting the officer at risk.

HappySeller2014

Thank you RipTide. I like keeping things as factual and defensible as possible.

What people are failing to see here is cops are finely trained in what is called "threat identification." When a cop is concentrating on a subject, and others, either directly or indirectly intervene, the threat level is deemed increasing. The cop(s) must now focus on multiple, competing situations, which is more threatening in and of itself, and thus cops will take action to adress this heightened and elevated threat environment.

Sometimes things can go very badly. Why folks cannot understand this I fail to undrstand.

niceund

People are concerned about the radio interview. I wonder if these same people are concerned that Ben McShane used Facebook?

Hagen is an egotistical political hack. He should be arrested. Just because he carries the name "councilman" doesn't make him God. Keegan-Ayer is washing her hands and your Executive is quiet. Talk about politics.

public-redux

Yes, I agree that the High Sheriff's behavior was as bad as McShane's.

Me too public-redux..me too. I think I'm going to start pointing that out to people, they seemed to have missed that detail.

mgoose806

Gardner doesn’t want to anywhere near Hagen. She has higher political aspirations and Supporting Hagen at this point will not go well for her. Unlike Hagen…Gardner has the sense to know actions have consequences.

Dwasserba

Talk about…not being his mother.

threecents

Jenkins says the incident is done for him. Since there are no charges against Kai, then the incident is done with me too.

petersamuel

Kai Hagen wants to have it both ways. He thinks he can avoid getting offside with the law and order public by saying he supports law enforcement and doesn't think county cops are racist. That's ridiculous. Of course he thinks they are racist. He says he pulled over and intervened after he noticed the driver was 'black' even though he saw nothing "untoward" happening between the cop and the driver. Plus he says he hopes the event will "foster conversation around race and racism in the county." If the event was not a case of racial discrimination how is conversation around race and racism fostered by discussing it? The guy is a scatter brain.

Plumbum

In Maryland police have a year and a day to write a ticket.

So would the deputy involved please go Cite Sly Kye for failure to obey a lawful order. anD anything else you can charge him with?

Odd they haven’t done that yet? Perhaps tomorrow?

Plumbum

Probably because the deputies do not know they can do this. And Sly Kye is here running his chops to reporters. Self incrimination on Sly Kye’s behalf if in the event the deputy would heed my advice

Oh but plumbum the point of this whole show from Jenkins isn't because of what Kai did...the deputy would have given Kai a ticket by now if Jenkins actually cared about his deputies lives. Which if you think about it ....it's rather disgusting that he hasn't had his deputies write Kai a ticket yet...I mean it just shows that Jenkins cares more about political grandstanding than his deputies lives....or anyone else's lives for that matter...so....I can see things clearly now, can you?

sevenstones1000

Who says it was a lawful order? Let’s test that. Where in the constitution is a cop’s guarantee of secrecy?

Plumbum

[thumbup]

phydeaux994

I guess they’ll just have to agree to disagree. These two have had intense dislike of one another for decades

Watergirl

I think Jenkins over-the -top reaction and his subsequent radio appearance are very politically motivated. Hough, a Tea-Party Republican who is in the thrall of the Koch’s just happens to be running for County Executive, too. Wouldn’t be surprised if Jenkins isn’t trying what other Republican operatives have done to try to diminish reputations of Democrats who happen to be running for County positions. Plus we know Jenkins profiles people of color as evidenced by his harassment of Hispanics. Plus, being a big Trump fan, he is a big supporter of shutting down immigration. God help all of us if immigrants aren’t available to work the many key jobs that keep Frederick County going- God, that would leave us with what? No one! Jenkins needs to be booted. He’s too much of a good ol’ boy. Let’s get some new blood in the County Sheriff’s Office- a person who has more than a Neanderthal approach in people skills. As for Kai Hagen, he is a liberal Democrat and has always been one.

Agreed purely fake political outrage on Jenkins part which is why I’m defending Kai!

I know Jenkins a little too well ……I’ve meet him a thousand times already and will no doubt meet him a thousand times more.

No worries though Jenkins isn’t running again…he just wants to take a few people down with him before he goes. Jenkins is a tad angry about the new police reform laws that Maryland passed and no one has ever held him accountable before so he’s going to get out before he’s held accountable. He ain’t staying he’s seen what’s happening to Trump. If Trump had never been President he still be criming along right now.

Plumbum

For someone who prides herself on accuracy, you sure embarrass urself a lot, miss Horne.

Never “ claimed to know and understand”. Never. Ever.

Has it ever occurred to you that I clearly have or have had direct information, resources, or contacts to within the FCSO?

You’re Dr Google here. The time you spend wrongly telling me I’m wrong is time you can spend researching my factual statements.

Yes, general order states no county owned vehicles to be used for political campaign or political fundraisers. This includes driving a cruiser to a carnival or fair and handing out (but not limited to) brochures and stickers. as well as driving to campaign fundraiser dinner events.

Am I obligated to reply to you Gabbs? No.

Call me a liar. Call me wrong. I do not care. You seem to think calling me this and calling me that bothers me. It doesn’t.

Trumpkins knows what he did. Former and current command staff knows what he did and they know exactly what I’m talking about. And maybe, just maybe that’s who my post is intended for.

I assure you, There are long retired deputies that are reading my comment and this reply that are shaking their head “yes” in agreement with my every word.

You’re so focused on trolling me and trolling me, that it’s hindering you from pausing and thinking for 10 seconds as to how I know this. Who I know. And / or, where I’ve been.

So there’s that :)

gabrielshorn2013

Yeah, you claim to have all of those contacts in the FCSO, plumbum. But why is it that half the time they're completely wrong? I mean, come on, the Pagans involved in Cactus Flats that you were so adamant about, citing your “inside sources”, and was so completely wrong about? And that's just one example of your alleged "inside sources". The amount and timing of the Santos settlement (one year before it actually happened, and off by more than an order of magnitude) is another. If you and the former staff know what he did, well why not come right out and say it? I mean, you will have the full backing of former staff, right? They’ll come to your support and defense, right? No risk of a lawsuit because the claims are substantiated by sworn testimony, right? No, you just keep up with the lame innuendo, afraid that if you make a specific false claim of wrongdoing that you are liable for slander and libel. That, dear plumbum, is cowardice, by definition.

Plumbum

I do not and have not read long replies. 95% of the content u write to me, I have not ever read.

Why?

Because your feelings don’t matter.

I stated the general order specifically says “no no don’t do that”

I stated Trumpkins did that.

And it’s a fact. And it’s unethical.

Anything you have to say about what I wrote is not worth reading.

I’m not a loner, I’m not like you. I’m active. And I am friends with many people in the county. It’s a small county. Many former deputies and command staff know me. Some of the current command staff knows me. Just because your an introvert and don’t get out, doesn’t mean I don’t know anything that goes on.

You read my posts.

I do not read your replies to me.

Yes, I see you’re replies. If it’s a long reply, I may read the first sentence and maybe the last. But I do not read your replies.

I write comments based on actual first hand knowledge. I’m not obligated to divulge my sources. Trumpkins is vindictive. He has harassed certain deputies because of their affiliation with certain people. Another fact. A fact you didn’t know. And since you’re not aware, then Plumbum must certainly be lying.

General order states as I say.

Trumpkins violated general order.

Retired deputies and current long time deputies reading this and know exactly what I’m referring to.

Respond all you want. The facts will not change. Respond respond respond respond. Call me this. Call me that. Big deal, who cares! Facts still unchanged.

gabrielshorn2013

Bla, bla, bla plumbum, and again you're lying. If you don't read my posts, how do you know how to respond to them? Denial is more than a river in Egypt. Don't like my responses? Don't read them, as you already claim you don't. Loner???? ROFLMAO!!! You don't realize it, but yes, we've met, and we have spoken several times, LOL. I still run into you on occasion socially. Keep trying.

Plumbum

Sly Kye is an idiot. I disagree with the above. He’s an idiot. Foolish thing for him to do.

It’s as foolish as Gabbs saying I’m a liar when I wrote about all the settlements fcso his paid out, when they could have been prevented from the start, and. When I wrote about Trumpkins violating the 800+ page General Order. They both THINK they’re Saving the World.

gabrielshorn2013

No plumbum, you are not lying about those settlements, and I never said you did. Reading compréhension problem on your part, or more innuendo (aka, lies) from you. I call you a liar when you imply (innuendo) that the Sheriff, himself, committed the acts that led up to those settlements. He did not. Go back through the actual records for the facts. You claim to know and understand this "800 page general order", yet you haven't been able to provide a link to the document when asked, which suggests that you have never actually read it yourself. You are merely repeating a synopsis of someone else's opinion. No, not trying to save the world, just pointing out your "un-truths". You can do better.

niceund

Go do a ride along with a deputy and see just how dangerous that incident was.

sevenstones1000

How was it dangerous? So it is safer if it is conducted in secrecy where the cops can do whatever they want?

gabrielshorn2013

How was this done in secrecy seven? The officer radios to the dispatcher that they are stopping license plate XXX-XXXX and the reason for that stop. A report is then filed with the outcome of that stop (ticket or written warning issued?). All of this information is discoverable in any legal proceeding.

mwoerner

I totally agree with you "niceund"! It is dangerous enough to be an officer on the side of the road not to mention having someone not involved in what is going on to pull over and question what you are doing. This was a traffic stop not an accident and besides the officer and the driver of the car there should have been no one else involved. I myself feel for every law enforcement office on the side of the road, most drivers will move over to another lane but at 55mph...if anyone does the speed limit anymore... some have no chance to move over and standing next to cars driving like they do on Route 15 is taking your life in your own hands. Let law enforcement do their job and move on.

Welcome to the discussion.

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