We hope all students and their families enjoy their long Labor Day weekend. On Tuesday, it’s back to school.

And there’s probably a more than good chance this could be the last post-Labor Day start of school for Frederick County students.

So we hope you enjoyed those Labor Day vacations while they lasted.

The Maryland State Legislature this session passed a bill that gives school scheduling power back to exactly where it should be: the local jurisdictions.

This means the Frederick County Board of Education will get to build out their school schedule going forward, eschewing a Gov. Larry Hogan executive order that mandated counties start school after Labor Day and end by June 15.

Because the state requires students attend school for 180 days a year, the scheduling mandate required the local board of education to consider tough decisions like having students attend school on Fair Day or religious holidays like Rosh Hashanah.

“I’d rather the state either [mandate] the whole schedule or stay out of it,” Board of Education President Brad Young said in 2017 of the scheduling frustration. “We’re told we can’t give students [days] off for religious holidays, but then state law says we have to give them [Good Friday and Easter Monday] and Dec. 24 to Jan. 2.”

We agree. The state legislature should stay out of it. But we would caution the county against permanently moving the school start before Labor Day.

Data shows Marylanders overwhelmingly support starting school after Labor Day, and the economic benefit is hard to ignore. According to a report from Comptroller Peter Franchot’s office, the state would generate $74.3 million in economic activity with a post-Labor Day start.

Most advocates of a pre-Labor Day start argue that it gives students more time to learn and therefore boosts achievement. But, a study by Virginia Commonwealth University found no correlation between a school district’s start date and student achievement.

However, we’re aware of the scheduling challenges that befall the Board of Education on certain years depending on the day on which Labor Day falls. Take next year, for instance. Starting school after Labor Day would mean a Sept. 8 start date. With a June 15 end date, t’s unlikely the district could fit the required amount of school days in the calendar under that restriction. A pre-Labor Day start may be needed.

Perhaps the school could explore a post-June 15 end date to give students and families the post-Labor Day start, but even that might be tough to fit in and still give students a summer vacation that starts in June.

Issues with the dreaded state mandated testing might also pose a problem. But, pushing the school calendar to end later in June each year, could give families some more consistency in planning their vacations each year.

Like with most complex issues, however, it will likely take some compromise. Some years, maybe students do need to start school before Labor Day. Perhaps the school board could explore eliminating teacher professional development days one year and Fair Day on another year to make the calendar work.

The correct agency now has the power to make the decisions based on building the school calendar. But they’d be wise to heed to popular public opinion when wielding that power.

(83) comments

jerseygrl42

lets hope the board does the right thing and keeps the scheduled start post Labor Day as it was for many decades with no problems

LeonardKeepers

the start of the school year should stay at after labor day and this so called data shows that the majority of Marylanders approve of school starting after labor day,then so be it.this boo hooing of how hard it is to schedule,the way to fix that is cut out a lot of the holidays.they do not need a week off at thanksgiving and a week off at Easter break. plan for more than 3 to 5 days of snow days.

threecents

Good editorial. Hogan made bad decision to take away county's ability to set their own calendars and give more space for snow days if they want to. As for arguments about parent teacher conferences, there are ample opportunities for them and parents and teachers often email, sometimes Ccing principals or others on the team.

richardlyons

[thumbup]

aaronjansen1

We have to complete any vacation by the 2nd Sunday of August because the kids' school-based extracurricular activities begin. For us,we might as well start the 3rd or last week of August since we're home anyway because of school functions.

shiftless88

Move the dang fair to the end of August

pfitzgerald

If Labor Day is September 4 or earlier, start after Labor Day. If Labor Day is September 5 or later, start one week earlier. Adjust June end dates accordingly. Sounds reasonable to me.

hayduke2

Teacher bashers and those who think they understand teaching are out in force. You wouldn't last a month in a classroom.

gabrielshorn2013

Not bashing hay. They were stating historic facts. Growing up, our PTCs were always in the evenings after parents got home from work. Teachers are salaried, not hourly. As salaried employees, we work until the job is done, not until the bell. Grading papers, planning, etc. is a part of the job, just like in other professions. If teaching was an hourly job, the union should install a punch clock at the door. The 10 weeks off in the summer allows the opportunity to chill, or get a part-time summer job. Again, not bashing. I taught for 25 years at the college and graduate level.

hayduke2

Well, I have 35+ years in public education as well. Folks who have no experience with teaching making decisions is not good for public education. Leave it to the professionals in the field. As an aside, teaching in public schools, whether ES,MS or HS is very different from college and graduate level teaching. I have experience there as well.

HappySeller2014

Hayduke2, teachers are funded by taxpayer dollars. FCPS and teachers ultimately responsible to every taxpayer in Frederick County, whether they have children or any experience with the teaching profession, or not.



A taxpayer cannot tell a private college how to run itself. But a taxpayer has every right to raise concerns regarding public-funded state colleges and universities. Same is true at local county school level.



FCPS and its teachers have to listen. That is why we have an elected school board. And public hearings. Whether you like it or not, when my taxpayer dollars are at stake, you better listen.

hayduke2

Listen, sure. Always agree or adopt, not so much - you are entitled to your opinion but that doesn’t make it more valid than any other.

rbtdt5

"Leave it to the professionals in the field" hay - do you believe this with all professions or just teachers?

Pedro4Presidentagain

Agree -- Start after Labor Day and finish by June 1

Eliminate 'teachers professional days' and just focus on teaching the core curriculum



It seems like the FCPS and the BOE are more concerned with bathroom choices than teaching students

gabrielshorn2013

I still don't understand why starting school after Labor Day is such a big deal. Wasn't there a statewide poll a few years ago where over 70 percent favored a post-Labor Day start? Shouldn't that count?

hayduke2

By that reasoning, you agree that since over 70% favor stronger gun laws and the banning of certain high capacity firearms should count too.

gabrielshorn2013

As a teacher, you should know that you are comparing apples and pears hay. One is a policy, and the other an inherent right guaranteed by the Constitution. What do you teach again?

hayduke2

I'll disagree. Conceptually, your argument is that over 70 percent support something so that should count. Can't have it both ways and pick when that works.

gabrielshorn2013

Well hay, if that is the truth, then you should have no problem getting 2/3 of each house to pass a bill, then get 38 states to ratify it, right? The process for establishing a school year calendar is significantly different than amending the US Constitution. As I said, one is policy, the other is constitutional law. Apples and pears.

hayduke2

Sorry to disagree - I readily acknowledge that one is found in the constitution ( although exactly what that right is remains open to interpretation as evidenced by numerous state and court rulings ) but you premise was that 70% favor the after Labor Day start so that should count for endorsement of the issue. However , the same premise should apply to the CONCEPT even though the route to change is more arduous and politically charged.

shiftless88

Gabe; the restrictions being discussed for gun ownership do not violate the 2nd Amendment so your argument is a non sequitur

gabrielshorn2013

Do they shiftless? Please show what Supreme Court case said so. Heller and McDonald both affirmed the right to keep firearms for self protection. Heller also applies to weapons in common usage. If you are referring to the AR platform firearms, there are now estimated to be 20 million in the public's hands. Does that not confirm common usage? Semi-auto firearms make up half of all firearm sales. Furthermore, in your response please differentiate, other than cosmetic differences, between the AR platform and other semi-auto firearms, such as the Ruger Mini14, and the Remington 597. As for magazines, ok, several states have banned further sales of high capacity magazines, but most have not. There are tens of millions in circulation, and any sheet metal shop can easily fabricate them. How do you propose to remove them from circulation?

gabrielshorn2013

If I accept your premise hay, that even the Bill of Rights should be susceptible to majority rule, then would it be ok to suspend freedom of religion and impose Methodism on everyone if 50.1% of the population say so? How about forcing everyone to quarter soldiers? Shall anyone be subject to search and seizure of their property if the majority dictates? The presumption of innocence? As a teacher I would think that you would say no to these, or any other example regarding the Bill of Rights. These principles are inviolate, and protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority. Setting policy for what day to start school is up to the whim of the majority. Like I said, apples and pears.

shiftless88

Gabe; background checks have been instituted and not found unconstitutional. "Assault weapons" as defined have been banned in the past. Red flag laws have not been found unconstitutional. So basically restrictions being discussed have largely passed muster so complaining that they have anything to do with the 2A is disingenuous.

hayduke2

Well, since I was not advocating the premise you put forward, you can answer your own questions Gabe. BTW, did I in any way say that the ardous and political path to change should be circumvented? So maybe you should revisit your premise since you were the one advocating it. My point is you can't slelctively apply it to only those things you support.

hayduke2

Gabe- you do realize that your recent posts goes against your orignal 70 % premise.

gabrielshorn2013

OK, let's step back an look at what was said hay. You said:

"By that reasoning, you agree that since over 70% favor stronger gun laws and the banning of certain high capacity firearms should count too." So what is your premise here hay? In reading it, you are stating that since I believe that a poll stating that 70% of Marylanders favor a post-Labor Day start for schools, that I should also agree that a majority should have the say on issues involving the 2A, such as stronger gun laws and banning certain weapons, correct? If that is what you said (and it was), and I point out that there is a difference in changing a constitutionally protected right and a state-wide start date policy for school (subject to the will of the voters), where is the fault in my reasoning? Where is there a constitutionally protected right for a school day start? There is none, and to compare it to a constitutionally guaranteed right is silly. That is why I posted those questions. No one constitutional right is above the others. Public policy is another issue. If the voters of Maryland wanted to have full-year school, would you object? If so, on what grounds. If Maryland wanted to waive the 180 day school year, would you object? If so, on what grounds? The school year is set by the state. You, as an employee, can either accept it, or find another means of financial support. There are no Constitutional issues. As for me negating my own argument regarding the 70% favoring a post Labor-day start, only if you don't understand the difference between Constitutional issues and public policy decisions. But then again I guess you could, and are just carping. Oh...now I get it.

shiftless88

And again, Gabe, banning certain high-capacity firearms does not necessarily violate the 2A so it is a moot point.

gabrielshorn2013

Shiftless, I have never argued against background checks. As a matter of fact, I strongly support them, including the NICS check and completing form 4473. I also support prosecuting those that provide false answers to any of the questions on that form. However, that never happens for whatever reason, despite thousands that fail per year. Straw purchases are included on that form, but how many prosecutions have there been? My question is how do you enforce a 100% background check law without 100% firearm registration? You already know that there will be an extremely low level of registration compliance among the law abiding, and no compliance among the criminal element. There is simply no way to enforce such a requirement with north of 400 million weapons in circulation, and ignoring that fact is ignoring reality. Do I need to do a background check on my kids? My parents? Aunts and uncles that I have known my entire life that I would trust with my life? (OK, there are a couple of 2nd cousins that are sketchy) My best friend of 40 years? Where is the limit? Red flag laws? I support them, IF AND ONLY IF due process is followed to the letter, and there is an avenue for reparations should a false claim be made to preclude any mischief. I also support prosecuting those that violate the laws contained in 18 USC 922 to the full extent of the law with the penalties contained in 18 USC 924. No exceptions. No reducing the penalties, and all penalties served consecutively, not concurrently as many do now. Now finally to “assault weapons”. You have not answered my questions about what makes a firearm “an assault weapon”. I gave you three rifles that have the exact same semi-automatic functionality, fire the same caliber bullet, and are capable of accepting “high capacity magazines” (for this discussion meaning greater than 10 round capacity). Two would be perfectly legal under such a ban, but the AR, for whatever reason would not. Could you explain the difference to me?

hayduke2

Well, I read as you saying the majority favors the later start so it should be a no brained. If that premise is true, then that criteria should apply to other issues. You can add distractors and other parameters but the premise was yours, not mine.

gabrielshorn2013

No, it should not. Who said it should? Certainly not me. You inferred what was not implied.

joelp77440

That 70% number on guns laws is dependent on where you live. Some states, TX for example, have been loosing gun laws instead of tightening them. Personally, I think guns laws should be set by the state and not the federal government. If MD does not want AR-15s, cool, you can move to another state if you don't like it. MD already has very strict gun laws (ex., 10 round mags)

hayduke2

to imply is to suggest or throw out a suggestion, while to infer is to include or take in a suggestion. So, did your statement not imply that a 70% favorable poll be used in the decision. Or did you simply infer it?

gabrielshorn2013

Hay, my statement was merely a restatement of what was presented in the article. You stretched that statement regarding a specific case into an all statement, which was incorrect. The majority of Marylanders favor a post Labor Day school start. That's a fact, and was in the story. You took that fact and then asserted that if it was true, then a majority rule (in this case the 70% number presented in a previousFNP article) should also apply to gun laws. That may be true up to the point of where it interferes with the Constitutional guarantees of inherent rights of US citizens. In that case, your extension of my original statement does not follow. I can explain it to you, but I cant make you understand it.

hayduke2

inferred but not implied - kind of like your statement " I can't make you understand it" could imply something as well. [smile]

gabrielshorn2013

Still niggling I see. 🤣

HappySeller2014

As a child in Virginia three decades ago, all parent teacher conferences were held in the evenings. Did not disrupt school days plus made it more convienant for working patents to attend...especially if children were struggling and both parents needed to attend.



I started after Labor Day every year. Finished up first week in June every year Kindergarten through 12th grade.



Teacher workays unheard of. Students in class from 8:30 AM to 3:10 PM, so in order to put in a full eight-hour workday, teachers had an extra hour each day for planning purposes without kids around, plus 30 minutes for lunch.



Teachers out 10 weeks over summer.



FCPS teacher workdays need to be eliminated. FCPS teachers need to put in a full 40 hour workweek for the 40 weeks they work a year. I just looked at my kids' FCPS school schedules. They are in classes 8 AM to 3 PM every day. Therefore, teachers should have 3-5 hours to plan per week, not including a 30 minute lunch.



And some teachers waste away this time anyways.



FCPS teacher union ridiculously strong and FCPS and elected officials unwilling to demand and foster accoutability. This is plain dumb. Get rid of all teacher workdays and the fluff in the schedule. All three hour late arrvals and three hour early dismissals should be removed. Eliminate all this stupidity and kids and teachers could finish up school by June 6th every year, even with a post-Labor Day start.



My spouse is a teacher at a local private school. All parent teacher conferences are schedued between 5 and 9 PM in evenings. My spouse, and fellow teachers, simply make themselves available to discuss a child's progress in the evenings because it is THE RIGHT THING TO DO.



NO MORE whining and complaining. Most of the working world does not get off 10 weeks straight every summer. Even my spouse acknowledges the sweet deal he/she has...and does not constantly try to take, take, take. FCPS could easily shorten its yearly calendar by 10-12 days if it had the guts to do so, and requre work standards like the rest of the real world encumbers.



And, by the way, I am a salaried professional in my chosen field. I do not count hours or watch the clock. I am paid for 40 hours of honest, hard work a week, 52 weeks a year minus 13 days of earned vaction...and I usually put in 45 to 50 hours a week simply because it is THE RIGHT THING TO DO. And my 30 minute lunch, if I take it, is tacked on after any given eight hour workday, not part of the eight hours themselves.



The entitlement mentality that has seeped into our national, and even regional and local, collective conscience is saddening, disgraceful, and simply pathetic. Period.

timberman

I must say well written you have stated the obvious and the opinion of many The shame is most parents are afraid to express their true opinions for the real fear of Retribution which no doubt would be bestowed upon their children

HappySeller2014

Thank you Sir for your compliment. Much appreciated.

hayduke2

Try teaching and being in the classroom. Your perspective will change.

duffy5x

Become a teacher. I dare you.

HappySeller2014

Duffy, I have no interest in being a teacher. Chose my life's calling back in the late 1980s, and teaching did not make my short list.

butterflygirl

Teachers only get paid for 37.5 hours per week. Teachers put in many hours of their own time away from their own families. Many teachers spend their summer taking classes to become better teachers for their students. I get so annoyed when people say when I was in school. The expectations of today’s teachers is so much more. I will bet back in your day teachers were not expected to collect data after data information and then enter all that data into different places. Teachers were not expected to enter grades weekly for parents to see. Teachers were not expected to answer emails after emails. Some teachers are the only adult support some children receive. Teachers do not feel entitled. The problem is people these days have no respect for the job teachers do every day. The lack of respect teachers get from parents and students is terrible. I could go on and on but I feel with you I would be wasting my time.

HappySeller2014

Sorry. You bean count also...37.5 hours per week, eh? And summers off. I would argue less is expected today, and many have worked down to mediocre. Back in the day, no computers, no internet, no chromebooks. Much more labor intensive classroom materials and grading activities required of teachers back in the day.



I get paid for a 40 hour workweek in my profession. For 48 to 50 weeks per year, depending on time I can find for vacation. I usually put in about 50 hours at the office on any given week, not counting my lunch break. And, if I need additional tuteledge or education, I simply take night classes on my own time. So does the vast majority of salaried professionals in the real world.



No empathy here. Not a complainer here either. I feel blessed to have a steady job, with decent pay, and I personally get out of my job what I put into it. Last time I checked my hourly pay was when I worked at McDonald's back in high school. I made sure I got paid for every 15 minute interval, just like I am sure some folks do with the .5 of an hour you added to the 37.



As a salaried peofessional, the hours put in mean nothing to me. That is how the real world works. And last time I checked, FCPS teachers are salaried.

marinick1

[thumbup][thumbup][thumbup]

DickD

I agree with you, Happy and I went to school in New York. Depending on where and who I worked for, I worked 35 up to 60 or more hours a week. Maybe more if you count some travel time I had to do - not commuting, travel icw work.

HappySeller2014

Yep. When I travel, usually in evenings. Not during regular workday...that is when my customers need me. Just part of my salaried job...thanks DickD for the comment.

evanmoore

Ask your spouse how many kids doe s/he have in their class? We moved from private school to public school. The classroom sizes went from 12 kids (private) per class to 28+ kids (public) per class. That means, each public school teacher is doing double the work. That's double the grading, double the teacher to parent feedback... double everything.



As a son to a teacher, who my mother taught 40+ years in middle school, retired and is now a substitute teacher, she gave her nights and weekends to her kids and ran for school board to help make a difference for teachers.



Teachers are the hardest and most importantly people in our lives. They never stop working.

HappySeller2014

Again, no empathy here. Double class size does not equal double work, if you work smartly and efficiently. The public versus private school dichotomy offered up here is questionable and suspect at best. My spouse's salary is also much lower than the FCPS starting salary and she has been teaching for 15+ years. Just playing a tiny fiddle here with this class size argument.



The mother in this discussion sounds wonderful. But if you believe all in FCPS are as involved as she was, you are living in a dream world. It does appear the mother in this discussion took the term "salaried" for what it means...get the job done, not be a time bean counter. Good for her and the kids she taught. And for all of the other teachers who think like she does.



In my ealier postings I forgot to tell everyone I bring my laptop home every weekend with me. Sunday evenings can get busy for me too. A salaried professional who is respected knows this when he/she signs up for the job.



I agree teachers are very important. So are nurses. And police. And soldiers. And your dentist. And doctors. And the AAA truck driver who fixes your flat. And your car mechanic. And your barber. And the postal deliver person. And parents. As we all know, we all learn most of how to be successful in life from playing in our sandboxes as toddlers. Everyone else helps us along the way.



Smart salaried professionals never stop working. I agree wholeheartedly.

duffy5x

In what part of the "real world" does double the students not mean double the work? Oh yeah...the one people who aren't teachers but pretend to know about the profession live in.

HappySeller2014

So Duffy, you do not learn efficiency and effectiveness after working with a few kids? Or any type of repetitive activity?



Glad you not working for me. If you were good, you could handle more. I doubt you could handle a little bit of any endeavor.

marinick1

[thumbup][thumbup][thumbup]

hayduke2

Happy Seller - do you want those folks not involved in your profession dictating your day, hours and schedule? Good for the goose, good for ....

HappySeller2014

Hayduke2, FCPS teacher salaries are paid directly out of my state and local taxes I pay. Sales and property taxes. So YES, I have every right to make my conerns and position known.



As for my profession, it is not taxpayer funded. My company lives or dies by its succesful interaction with its customers. At the end of the day, anyone can dictate to my company how to run things, but I can ignore or disregard them...at my own risk.



When you funded by taxpayer dollars hayduke2, you are also ultimately responsible to the taxpayers.

hayduke2

And school and teachers meet that mandate every day. Too bad you can’t acknowledge that the vast majority of teachers are dedicated, work hard, know how to engage students and are heavy contributors to the success of generations of children. Taxpayers more than get their money’s worth.

Ugh2

Point one: Parent teacher conferences are held in the evenings and daytime to accommodate all parents. Most teachers I know will come in early, stay late, and do conferences at anytime during the school year to accommodate working parents.



Point two: "Teacher workays unheard of. Students in class from 8:30 AM to 3:10 PM, so in order to put in a full eight-hour workday, teachers had an extra hour each day for planning purposes without kids around, plus 30 minutes for lunch."



Incomplete sentences that truly don't make sense. What is the point of this?



Point three: Teacher work days, of which there are three total that impact students during the school year and one is at the beginning of Spring Break, a typically low attendance day, are important to teachers and honestly, if you aren't one, then you don't realize what happens on those days.



Point four: There are no three hour late arrivals or three hour early dismissals in our calendar. Also, all but one counts as a school day as lunch is served so removing them would be an exercise in futility.



Point five: What 10-12 days off would you suggest cutting? FCPS has control over only 6 of the days off we have for the 2019-2020 calendar year.



Point six: I am also a salaried professional in my chosen field. I do not count hours or watch the clock either. I am paid for 37.5 hours of honest, hard work a week, 43 weeks a year minus the three personal days and 10 sick days I earn. I usually put in 45-50 hours a week simply because it is THE RIGHT THING TO DO. And my 30 minute lunch, if I take it, is not paid.



The projection of one's own feelings of entitlement that has seeped into the editorial page of our local newspaper is saddening, disgraceful and simply pathetic.

Ugh2

I also need to add that our contractual day, for example, is 8:00-3:30 and all but our non-duty lunch for which we are not paid, is supervising students. The doors open at 8:00 and school instruction begins at 8:30 so during that half of an hour students are entering the building and need supervision. At the end of the day, instruction ends at 3:00 and students are dismissed at various times as car riders, walkers, and the bus riders. All parents and buses do not arrive at the same time so all students are not dismissed immediately. So the hour that is assumed we are without students is not there. Hence, the planning times and work days in which we can make copies, schedule parent meetings, plan meaningful and engaging lessons and gather those materials, clean up our classrooms, and the other tasks that accompany the job.

hayduke2

Ugh - nice statements. I'm surprised they didn't imply that those summer days are paid days. That argument really shows the ignorance of the profession.

HappySeller2014

Ugh2, I usually arrive at my office by 7:30 AM and leave around 6 PM on a daily basis. I usually get 30 minutes to an hour for lunch duringvthat timeframe. If my clients on the west coast need assistance, my workdays can increase to 10+ hours, as there is a three hour time difference between the coasts.



I see your contractual hours are from 8:00 AM to 3:30 PM, your lunchtime is in their somewhere, and you get off 10 or so weeks during the summertime.



So, what point you trying to make? We both on salary I assume.

HappySeller2014

Ugh2, none of your six points make any sense. Some are not points. Other statements, like the early and late dismissals are simply untrue...look at past years and this year's calendar.



Come on. At least make salient points that can contribute to the debate. Smoke and mirrors just makes you look silly!

Ugh2

Ok, I will spell it out for you more clearly:



You claim "Students in class from 8:30 AM to 3:10 PM, so in order to put in a full eight-hour workday, teachers had an extra hour each day for planning purposes without kids around, plus 30 minutes for lunch."



I countered that teacher are supervising children for that "extra hour each day." But in all honesty, I cannot make sense of your statement at all. I am assuming that you mean instruction happens from 8:30 AM to 3:10 PM. The contractual day would therefore be 8:00 AM to 3:40 PM with that hour you seem to claim teachers have not supervising students. All staff however is supervising students from the moment our contractual day starts until the end minus our unpaid 30 minute lunch.



You claim: "FCPS could easily shorten its yearly calendar by 10-12 days if it had the guts to do so."



I countered that FCPS/BOE has control over 6 days of the calendar that are not mandated by the state. Again, how should they cut 10-12 days?



You state: "All three hour late arrivals and three hour early dismissals should be removed."



I countered that there are no three hour early dismissals or arrivals. I have the calendar in front of me. There are two hour early dismissals and four hour delayed openings and one 3.5 early dismissal.

Also, on those days lunch is served so they count towards the 180 requirement so removing them would be moot.



Clear now?

duffy5x

You are obviously very impressed with your own work ethic. You weakly compare teachers to yourself constantly. You don't even have smoke and mirrors, you only have narcissism and misinformation. Pathetic.

HappySeller2014

Duffy, you scared of the real world?

threecents

HappySeller, How many hours you personally work is not relevant to a discussion about teachers. Maybe you should find a job where you don't have to work that many hours.

hayduke2

Aw, the bitterness of public vs private comes out. Entitlement huh?

Ugh2

Interesting, isn't it?

duffy5x

Hate to break it to you. Arbitration is not binding and it is illegal in Maryland. "The teacher's union is ridiculously strong" is a complete and TOTAL fabrication. By the way...working 50 hours a week without compensation isn' t "right thing to do" it's just stupid. Period.

gabrielshorn2013

With all due respect duffy5x, working until the job is done, even if it means working 50+ hours a week to do so is the norm for salaried professionals in the US, not the exception. You are compensated for performance of a job, not the time it takes you to do it. There isn't a punch clock at any school from what I have seen, so teachers are salaried professionals.

HappySeller2014

Glad you not working for me Duffy. And millions of other bosses would not be happy with you either.



I work until the job is done.



Use you argument with folks in the military. Or police. Or hospital doctors and nurses that take on double 12 hour shifts.



You remind me of just another hourly paid bean counter. Put in your required time and then disappear.



People respect me and the time I put in at the office. And I live a great life - at work and at home with family - because of it.



If that is being stupid in your eyes, so be it - I learned a long time ago I cannot control the stupid folks in my life, just take advantage of them. I agreed to a salary to get my job done. If you flip burgers for a living Duffy, at least you can request overtime or double pay on holidays?

Dwasserba

"Perhaps the school could explore a post-June 15 end date to give students and families the post-Labor Day start..." (1) It's usually too hot here by then for toiling with backpacks and (2) parents will just take their kids and go on vacation.

youshouldknowbetter

I went to school in PG and Montgomery Counties. We started after Labor Day and were out before June 15th every year even with maje up snow days. The SOLUTION: there are more than 5 expendable days that can be used to send kids to school to include teacher work days and the parent conferences. Teachers should be more than capable of handling the work load without extra days off AND do the conference for 3 nights only when parents can actually go to them. Most people work and allot of them are single parents who cannot afford to take time off. Let's use our brains like past generations. STOP legislating everything that does not need to fixed and actually work on thing the need fixed.

hayduke2

What you purpose is exactly what happens now so I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

HappySeller2014

Hayduke2, you serious?

timberman

Total BS on the part of the School System Hogan has this Right leave it alone

hayduke2

NO, local school systems should have the right to make their schedules. Mandates do not work for everyone.

HappySeller2014

You are wrong hayduke2. For statewide consistency, a madate should be in effect. Are you proposing children be treated differenty because of where they live? Inner city versus coastline versus western mountains? Praytell, why do mandates not work for everyone?



We all are mandated to drive 70 MPH or less on MD interstates. No exceptions for certain cars, trucks, buses, motorcycles, RVs...all must obey mandated speed limit or face consequences.



You have state mandated testing. State madated teacher certification rules. State mandated afterschool and sports-related activities for both boys and girls.



A state mandated anual schoolyear is easy peasy. But always hard for the complainers, the whiners and the slackers to stomach.

marinick1

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hayduke2

Bet you've never spent time in a classroom, dealt with entitled and opinated parents like yourself, focused on kids well being and discipline issues, etc. So, you believe that the requirements and issues a large county with thousands of students are exactly the same as those found in Garret or similar. Get real.

hayduke2

So, why do we have lower speed limits on interstates in certain areas. Does a small town have the right to set their speed limit? Do states have the right to set their speed limit? Do other professionals have local mandates for their profession? Does a contractor in PA need a different license in MD? Your short sighted answer is not valid.

HappySeller2014

Hayduke2, you have a defeatist attitude with these entitled kids and their parents. Stand up to them and tell them to suck eggs. If teachers do not, these precious little kids will get smacked around really quickly at age 18 once they get into the real world.



I cannot tell you how many times I have visited college career fairs only to see helicopter mommy or daddy standing next to 21-year old Timmy or Sally. Trust me, not only are these kids going nowhere in their careers, but mommy and daddy are doing them a huge disservice and injustice.



The real world is not kind. Your job is to stand up to these entitled kids to make sure you and their parents are not wussifying them!

HappySeller2014

Hayduke2, you making no sense again with your road comments. Local jurisdictions can mandate local speed limits. State and national entities can mandate state and interstate speed limits.



But, national law trumps state law, and state law trumps local law. You know that.

hayduke2

Stand up to those entitled a parents and students - hmmmm. How would you respond to such a conversation?

marinick1

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