So there was another candlelight vigil (Monday night) about this weekend’s mass shootings in El Paso and Dayton.

The invitation to this event said “Hate has no home here.”

But it does, if “here” is the United States.

When are we going to go bonkers on this stuff and act like the radicals of our youth — the Berrigan brothers, et al.? (Oh, and that radical named Jesus???)

This is baloney, to use a polite term. Activism is called for in big ways on the events of this past weekend and every day in our country.

National Public Radio on Sunday reported that there have been 251 mass shootings (which include four or more people other than the shooter).

This year. What?

It’s Aug. 4, you gotta be kidding me. Go ahead, fact check this and you’ll find it’s true. (I thought maybe 251 since 2014 or 2010 or….)

Remember that famous definition of insanity? Doing the same thing (prayers and heartfelt feelings for victims and their families and friends, candlelight vigils, etc.) over and over and expecting different results?

Well, we’re insane if we expect this to change.

We need to either be very radical on this issue or admit that we expect 30-plus mass shootings to occur each month and we don’t care enough to change.

Aren’t we facing worse times than the Vietnam War when the best of our Catholic brothers and sisters (the Catonsville Nine) got locked up for burning draft records in the very Catholic birthplace of Maryland?

Thomas Kloc

Frederick

(86) comments

Obadiah Plainsmen

















Who and What is a Militia:

10 U.S. Code § 246. Militia: composition and classes

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/246

hayduke2

So, it is the National Guard... And considered a branch of the military.

Obadiah Plainsmen

Now look at Article I Section VIII Clause 15 & 16 the Militia Clause

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/article-1/section-8/clause-15%E2%80%9316

"The term “militia of the United States” was defined to comprehend “all able-bodied male citizens of the United States and all other able-bodied males who have . . . declared their intention to become citizens of the United States,” between the ages of eighteen and forty-five".

hayduke2

I did - and it is otherwise known as the National Guard...

Obadiah Plainsmen

Wonder how 9 Justices will interpret it? As Justice Thomas has said, we have established a personal right to bear arms, but we haven't told people the full extent of that right. For the first time since 'Heller" the Supreme Court has put a 2A case on their fall docket in October, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association v. City of New York. Their decision will add more fodder for the 2020 candidates to chew on.

MD1756

It's simple. When they wrote the US Constitution and its first ten amendments they were careful in the words they used. When they used the term "the people" or "citizens" they meant individuals not counties, states or other levels of government. When they meant the powers or rights of the states, they used the term "state" (for example, see the 10th amendment). While the 2nd amendment talks about the need of a state, the right is given to "the people," just like the 4th amendment gives "the people" the right to be secure in their persons ....

petersamuel

Everyone is agreed that these shootings are appalling and should be stopped. But how? What measures do we take to achieve that agreed objective? Mr Kloc, the letterwriter doesn't say. All he says is he'd be in favor of "very radical" action. Like what?

awteam2000

There’s a plethora of gun control options available without violating the Second Amendment. Don’t worry nothing will be done under this administration.

bosco

The same that was done under the previous administration, and the one before that, and the one before that.

awteam2000

The one before that had a moratorium on assault weapons. Remember?

phydeaux994

Peter Samuel, no gun control advocate has claimed that gun control laws would STOP gun violence. No laws about anything have achieved that. The idea is to REDUCE the killing and maiming and devastation of gun violence. Maybe start by keeping guns out of the hands of underage kids in Frederick County Maryland to cut down the number of shootouts on our streets from 1(so far) to zero. Every other deadly product in America is regulated except the most deadly threat to our citizens, the gun. How did that happen???

hayduke2

Interesting take on the 2nd Ammendment and its meaning. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/what-americas-gun-fanatics-wont-tell-you-2016-06-14?fbclid=IwAR1OpikfjRqHyIroNnFB1KDliUk_3_UMHdoZOhHtkcI0nNM_d8bTAW2OOM0

rikkitikkitavvi

Here is another one.



https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2019/03/07/rebutting-grammar-argument-second-amendment/

hayduke2

Great unbiased source [lol][lol][lol][lol]

Lev928

No ... we don't need mass shootings. Period. The problem is angry people with access to guns, and the mentally ill with access to guns. Both are not equal by social and medical (psychological) standards. Now ponder this ... the term "mass shooters" has replaced the term "mass killers" over time. If a serial murderer (serial killer) shoots all of his/her victims over the course of his/her murderous crime spree, when did they turn into a "mass shooter"? They haven't .. because the media created the term "mass shooter". Serial killers that kill all of their victims by firearms over any period of time are also "mass shooters" by definition. Here is the second problem: Many of the pro-gun (a.k.a. Pro-2nd Amendment) people out there that proclaim their right to bear arms to defend themselves and others are living within a false ideology. By that, I mean that people with little or no extensive, real-world firearms training and experience are useless with a firearm to defend themselves or others. Sure, you can own a firearm ... but unless you're trained with it, chances are you'll fail to stop the threat and most likely cause further harm to yourselves and others (not to mention the severe civil liabilities that you'll face in the end). The old phrase "actions speak louder than words" actually means something in both cases.

cleanrunoff

There is no amount of deaths that will supersede the natural rights enshrined in the Constitution. The price of freedom can be high, as we have seen, but who would want the alternative? No guns? Remember the slogan, "I would rather die on my feet than live on my knees." That, my friends, is the freedom we must preserve, no matter the cost. While tragic, also remember that dead people, the martyrs for freedom, also will never have abortions. So it's all a win, and freedom is preserved.

Lev928

The United States Constitution does not encompass any "natural right". The Constitution was formed to protect the People from the Government (federal, state, local). If anything "civil rights" encompasses certain "natural rights" as human beings. Don't confuse the Second Amendment with civil rights. They are not the same.

User1

Is that your “Cliff Notes” version?

Thewheelone

Read the preamble, Lev. The Constitution's purpose goes a lot further than protecting us from the government and or tyranny.

threecents

The sad thing is that many on the left agree with Clean's satire.

threecents

Sorry, many on the Right (not left) agree with Clean.

rikkitikkitavvi

You had it right the first time cents.

phydeaux994

How do guns keep us free? How are guns preventing Trump from ignoring the Constitution and the Rule of Law and turning America into his own little Dictatorship, Department by Department. Every Cabinet position filled with his Henchmen, SCOTUS in his pocket, The Senate controlled by Moscow Mitch, “The Grim Reaper”, the Media the “Enemy of the People”, Democrats “Hate America”, are Baby Killers, want Open Borders so criminals can enter the Country to murder and rape, are Socialists, blah, blah, blah. 60% of Americans, that’s a majority BTW, disagree with yours and Don’s vision. Is that the FREEDOM you are talking about? And guns are helping Trump keep those Freedoms? And the martyrs of freedom that separate children from their parents and put them in cages, arrest the illegal alien workers while the illegal American employers go free? Guns are preserving that? The fact that you are safer in your home and on the street without a gun than you are with one. The fact that no Country has ever stopped a hostile takeover by their Government because their citizens had millions of illegal guns? That’s a win and freedom is preserved?? I’ve got a gun, had guns since I was 12. I have absolutely no problem with most legal guns. It’s the illegal, anonymous and guns of mass destruction that bother me.

rikkitikkitavvi

There is a difference between Liberty and Freedom. to be Free is to take ownership of what goes on between your ears, to be autonomous in thoughts first and actions second. Your freedom to act a certain way can be taken away from you – but your attitude about your circumstances cannot – making one’s freedom predominantly an internal construct.

"Liberty” is predominantly an external construct. It’s the state of being free within society from oppressive restrictions imposed by authority on one’s way of life, behavior, or political views.

awteam2000

What’s natural about a 100 bullet magazine and bullet protection gear? Anyone but this is clearly looking for a battle. That's not natural.

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awteam2000

I don’t see one. You pick for me.

phydeaux994

Oops, sorry cleanrunoff, I have accused others here of not getting subtle sarcasm and now I am guilty of it. So I’ll pretend you were serious and let my comment stand. 🥵

cleanrunoff

[thumbup]

hayduke2

Good one Clean....

secpol1970

Another moronic diatribe for the far left.

rikkitikkitavvi

Secpol1970 They are a gift that keeps on giving. Can you think of any other gifts that keep on giving? Not the good kind.

public-redux

“Should we accept 30 mass shootings per month?”



Sure, why not?

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rikkitikkitavvi

User1 answered the question YOU so conveniently evaded pub because you knew the correct answer, would make the democrats look extremely negligent in actions as well as words. THAT is why it matters where they occur.

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rikkitikkitavvi

MY bad pub it was phydo that evaded the question initially. You just happened to get in the way.

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public-redux

Dennis, why would I care if Dems look bad?

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public-redux

Useless1, If we accept 30 mass shootings a month, why does it matter where they happen?

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phydeaux994

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phydeaux994

I see you’re not going to let this go rikkitikkitavvi. Anyone can conduct a survey or study on any subject, defining the criteria it will be based on, and publish a Report of their findings. Gun Violence Archive, founded by an avid gun owner and collector, has published a Report every year since 2014, titled Mass Shootings in “year”, based on the definition of 4 or more persons shot in each incident, as there is no official definition of “Mass Shootings”. If someone else wanted to conduct a survey on Mass Shootings using different criteria, they would have to go through the same process and publish a Report on their findings titled differently I assume. Every Organization that wanted to conduct their survey on Mass Shootings using different criteria, likewise. So what is your issue rikkitikkitavvi?? Get cracking on your survey.

rikkitikkitavvi

I have no issue seeing as how this phrase "as there is no official definition of “Mass Shootings” was in YOUR post and NOT attributing it to any other person other than YOUR self. That was MY point. Bless your little heart for admitting it.

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hayduke2

Last time I looked, those cities along with El Paso and Dayton have voters that have an R, D and I in there affiliation. Thought being patriotic and an American means that every citizen counts. Thanks for showing your true stripes once again.

hayduke2

their not there...

DickD

Having owned a gun since I was 16, it's hard for me to understand what is causing all of the shootings. I do know we didn't do this, at least the way it is happening now, years ago. Some of the reasons are easily available guns, but that's hardly new. Coverage by the media is far greater and Trump causing his hate rallies is new. His election campaign and his rallies with supporters yelling; "Lock her up." is new. Now he's getting members at his rallies to yell; "Send them back." All of the time with a self righteous smirk, signaling he wants more, then denying that he didn't cause it or know how to stop it.



Biden's speech summed up Trump very good. It's disheartening to realize how many in the U.S would support this sick man. Any normal person doing what Trump is doing would be locked up.

BunnyLou

Dick you are going to believe what you believe, but look inward at yourself and your party to see how hate filled you really are.

bosco

BunnyLou - If one stands back in an objective manner, something hard to do, you will see more hate and vitriol being spewed from the far left than the far right. Hate consumes the vessel it is carried in, including the hate-mongers on CNN and MSNBC.



It is also interesting to note that little is being said about the Dayton shooter being an avowed socialist and a supporter of Bernie and Warren. Notice how CNN and MSNBC blame Trump for the El Paso shooting, but don't blame Bernie or Warren for the Dayton shooting?

threecents

Maybe true, as we tend to get angry when people like you make truthy stuff up.

awteam2000

“stands back in an objective manner, something hard to do, you will see more hate and vitriol being spewed from the far left than the far right.” You forgot to mention you would have to spin around till you were dizzy, stand on one foot, while holding your breath with your eyes crossed.🤦‍♂️





Did the Dayton mass murderer have a manifesto quoting hate speech from Saunders or Warren? The El Paso White Suprematist did. His goal was to murder as many Hispanic people in El Paso as possible. In his manifesto, he quotes Donald Trump’s, verbatim hateful rhetoric. Trump clearly inspired the El Paso White Suprematist murderer. There is NO evidence that the Dayton shooter was motivated to act based on Saunders or Warren. NONE!

bosco

Check it out and review the references and ask yourself why the Dayton shooting is not being blamed on the left and Elizabeth Warren.

From Wikipedia:

"Soon after the attack, law enforcement confirmed that the gunman was Connor Stephen Betts, a 24-year-old born in Bellbrook, Ohio on October 28, 1994.[22][23][14][24] He had posted tweets that opposed Donald Trump and supported Elizabeth Warren, made favorable references about Satan, and described himself as a "leftist".[25][26][27] Although many of his tweets were mundane and non-political, he had retweeted posts that supported the antifa movement and opposed U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents and police officers. In the hours before he opened fire in Dayton, he "liked" a post in favor of gun control, and several concerning the 2019 El Paso shooting, including a tweet that called the El Paso shooter a "terrorist" and a "white supremacist."[27]"


awteam2000

Again, how was the Dayton mass murderer influenced by Sanders or Warren? Was it economic inequity? Universal healthcare? Maybe greater gun control. Based on that logic, the shooter was motivated to kill his sister and her acquaintances because of Saunders or Warren’s influential words. You might think so, I don’t ... But I do feel Trump’s hate filled White Supremacist knowledge chatter has sanction assaults base on racial biases. Don’t you? Or is it all good?

DickD

Hate filled Bunny? I don't want anyone to be hurt with a gun - or anything else. It's you that wants this.

phydeaux994

DickD, we have our differences but you make many Right On comments. This is a Right On comment. 👍

DickD

If my memory is correct, you are Republican, which is okay with me. Having an alternative to vote for is good, as long as it is a reasonable alternative. Trump and his cult are not reasonable. You are not one of them.

rikkitikkitavvi

I agree that Monday was a sad day across this country. It was an even more tragic day for the people that were directly involved with this event. Hate IS a ginormous plague on this country. But it largely depends on someone's definition of the word hate. Put a qualifier on the word. Which Hate are you talking about? There are many definitions of the same word. Kind of like is.



"When are we going to go bonkers?" The answer in my opinion only Is when tragedy strikes in your own back yard. I'm not talking about cross country.I'm not talking about across your State. I'm not even talking about a day trip. I'm talking about your community.



Right now, all you can really do is write opinion letters that make you feel good while a part of your brain tells you: "you did something good today.



Thirty" mass shootings" per month? That sure sounds like a lot. Almost like one every day. Spin anyone? I'm curious to know where you found any definition of a "mass shooting"? NPR? Media bias is another story. Or is it really.The FBI has definitions for "mass killing" and "mass murder". Do they have one for mass shooting?



For brevity's sake I'll jump forward. "We need to either be very radical on this issue or admit that we expect 30-plus mass shootings to occur each month and we don’t care enough to change." The first seven words interest me the most. That's a very strong opinion. Let me say this in the kindest way: Why don't you go join the*hateeverythingwithutteroutrageanddisdainment* club nearest you.



Can You Hear Me Now?



Have a nice day

FCPS-Principal

We don't believe your phony baloney first sentence anymore.

phydeaux994

rikkitikkitavvi, there have been 248+ mass shootings (defined as 4 or more shot at each shooting) in America in 2019, about 1.2 each day of the year so far. Here is a list: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2019

rikkitikkitavvi

Wow phydo! That many? Then I suggest We Do Something. Don't you? My first suggestion would be to enforce the laws on the books where the majority of these "mass shootings" occur. Would you be so kind as to look up that information in your handy, dandy wikipedia source? If you focus it shouldn't take you that long. Thanks. I'll wait.

phydeaux994

rikkitikkitavvi, this fact has been reported on every major news source since the shootings, except of course the Trump State TV Fox Propaganda Channel. That is why you haven’t seen it. Where they happened is included in the link I gave.

rikkitikkitavvi

Look at who DEFINED mass shooting on your website and who agrees with the definition. That speaks volumes of it's accuracy. As I said above: the FBI ( A Federal entity) has defined mass murder and mass killing but not mass shootings. I asked you to find out where the "mass shootings" occur. NOT mass murder or mass killings as defined by the FBI. I asked you to do one thing and you can't get it right. Try again or admit that you failed.



This is a list of mass shootings in the United States that have occurred in 2019. Mass shootings are incidents involving multiple victims of firearm-related violence. The precise inclusion criteria are disputed, and there is no broadly accepted definition.[2][3]

Gun Violence Archive, a nonprofit research group that tracks shootings and their characteristics in the United States, defines a mass shooting as an incident in which four or more people, excluding the perpetrators, are shot in one location at roughly the same time.[4] The Congressional Research Service narrows that definition further, only considering what it defines as "public mass shootings", and only considering victims as those who are killed, excluding any victims who survive.[2] The Washington Post and Mother Jones use similar definitions...

rikkitikkitavvi

https://www.thetrace.org/2015/10/mass-shooting-tracker-redditors-challenge-fbi-data/ *****

https://newrepublic.com/article/123027/heres-why-no-one-can-agree-number-mass-shootings



Who defines what is very important. But you know that.

rikkitikkitavvi

Let me refine the question even further. I want to know which cities have the most mass shootings with less than four killed. Does that help phydo?

phydeaux994

And that is exactly what this source lists, “mass shootings”. You obviously haven’t looked at it. It also acknowledges that the definition of “mass shootings” varies and has a list of other sources with their definitions. Many of them say 3 or more shot at each incident. Some advice, “if you find yourself standing in a hole, stop digging”.

Again, and again, and again, rikkitikkitavvi, the referenced link has a list of every incident, where it happened, how many were shot, how many were killed, and how many were injured. The report has nothing to do with Cities. That about covers it doesn’t it rikkitikkitavvi????

rikkitikkitavvi

Wrong. Less than 4 killed according to the FBI is not a mass murder OR a mass killing. You are evading the question. One more time. I want to know which cities in the United States have the most mass shootings with less than four killed in each shooting incident? I can't understand the question for you.

phydeaux994



As of July 31, 2019, 248 mass shootings have occurred in 2019 that fit the inclusion criteria of this article. This averages out to 1.2 shootings per day. In these shootings, 979 people were injured and 246 died (for a total of 1,325 victims).

rikkitikkitavvi

" that fit the inclusion criteria of this article" This article is all bluster. A rant if you will.

phydeaux994

I guess the question is when is one, or two, or? of those adolescent girls going to tell of the times Don was present at one, or two, or? of Jeff’s venues for a Party?


User1

Wow! Get rid of the ones that happen in Dimocratic led cities like Baltimore, Chicago, Detroit and others and that figure goes down by 90%!

jerseygrl42

should we accept a murder committed by an illegal alien every 4 hours???why is it no one seems to care about innocent citizens like Kate Steinle being killed by people who don't belong here ...more than 2,000 every year

Thewheelone

[offtopic], spin it somewhere else, Jersey

awteam2000

Where did you get your figures?



According to the CDC more than 38,600 deaths from guns in 2016 - of which more than 22,900 were suicides.



https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41488081



There is no national database that compares crimes committed by immigration status.

FCPS-Principal

Out her way-zoo of course, where all the other alternative facts come from.

FCPS-Principal

I know your stat is as phony as a Trump dollar bill, but if illegal aliens commit a murder every 4 hours, then citizens must commit one every 4 seconds. That's what one needs to fear.

BunnyLou

They don’t care about our citizens or the country. They only want to turn this country into a Guatemala or something similar.

public-redux

Guatemala? Shhhh! Trump recently signed an agreement identifying Guatemala as a “safe” country.

BunnyLou

I agree, one preventable death to many in the case of Kate. Her death should lie at the door step of those who want open borders, but it doesn’t phase them because they have no conscience. They also don’t care about the illegal opioids over the southern border. That amounts to a death sentence for those who are hooked. All in all they are un-ametican.

public-redux

You used to say 4000 per year. What happened?

Lev928

Jersey is right, regardless of statistics. Not a single murder committed by an illegal immigrant should have occurred in the United States. Ever. PERIOD.

public-redux

Of course, that isn’t what jersey wrote. What she wrote is wrong, much like jersey’s claim that people in their 90s are of working age.

wran

Here's what I think. Most of the mass shootings arise from domestic disputes, drug and criminal activities. They are not of the El Paso type. Most of the El Paso type shootings are conducted by people that are not insane. They are done by evil people that have various grudges against society and they can't cope with society. So they want to get even with society by doing something spectacular and make a statement. Most of them know exactly what they are doing and are not insane. As for the activism during the Viet Nam war, my opinion is that it was not as much against the Viet Nam war itself, but a protest against the draft. If there had been no draft, most of the activists would have cared less about the Viet Nam war.

Lev928

wran is fairly accurate in the statement. Those that don't know or understand the statement should research behavioral sciences. Many killers are not mentally ill. Many times, they're acting out against society (or specific genders) as a vengeful means against past physical abuse, sexual abuse and bullying. Some certainly are intentionally trying to create chaos for a certain political or ideological purpose. However, none of those factors equate to mental illness. These are simply people with a poor past history/influence -- making horrible decisions -- that somehow had access to a firearm or other weapon (whether it was theirs to legally possess or it was stolen).

awteam2000

You know the script... You’ll get what ever the NRA let’s Trump do. And he’ll claim “it’s the biggest, bestest mass shooting prevention measure ever in the world!” He’ll tie in the “Wall” and a couple of “dog whistles” for his base. Then the protagonist will somehow interject some deficiency on Obama’s part in defense of his lame inaction.🤷‍♂️

BunnyLou

Yes, we need to do something. Guns have been to great degree have been banned in DC, but the results speak for themselves. Same for Chicago and many other large urban areas. How are you going to activist away the black market in illegal or stolen fire arms. I submit that regardless what is done those that want to perpetrate mass killings will find a way.

gary4books

Too true to be good. Prohibitions hardly ever work as planned. We really need education to change our society, perhaps with the aid of churches and other organized study. But that will take years. Are we up for that long slog?

Samanthapowers

yes, the NRA is first and foremost in that group. they do everything within their power to shut down any meaningful legislation.

FCPS-Principal

The harm they promulgate against Americans earns them the Terrorist label. They support domestic terrorism just as directly as someone sending money to ISIS. Both let the puppets pull the triggers.

BunnyLou

Why? Because they support the constitution? At least they are honest and open about what they believe. There are several domestic terrorist groups here in the USA. ANTIFA, KKK, Black Panthers, Ayrian Brotherhood to name a few. They are ones that need to be removed from the field.

jerseygrl42

Very true , knives, vehicles, planes....etc

FCPS-Principal

Prohibitions limited to one city are useless. May as well ban them from a single city block.

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